In Progress Streets of Rage 2X By Kratus 2.3.1

[darknior]

- I suggest and made small SOR2 and SOR3 icons that you can add with the left and right arrow:

Yes it's really a good idée
Or why don't you let us launch SOR2 or SOR3 from the menu as different quest mode ...

- NPC ally character would be better if he stick to the gaming screen. Sometimes, he fights unreachable enemies offscreen and the player can't do anything.

Yes i see it on the last beta video too, it's better he can't go out of screen to fight ... but there will be the problem of the enemy that never come on screen if he don't go on the other side of the screen.

 

[16-bit Fighter]

Excellent news and thanks for this amazing update!

the game is ready to receive SOR1 content.

Do you plan to use SOR1 enemies and bgs from SORR? If so, why do not use all the bgs from SORR?

 

[Miru]

My suggestions for the next versions to come:

* Roo with accurate behavior, leaving screen once Bruce is defeated.
* Defensive special HP drain to be a recoverable drain, if not the BK3 meter as separate from block/RAGE meters.
* Soozie as a stronger variant of Garnet.

 

[Kratus]

My suggestions for the next versions to come:

* Roo with accurate behavior, leaving screen once Bruce is defeated.
* Defensive special HP drain to be a recoverable drain, if not the BK3 meter as separate from block/RAGE meters.
* Soozie as a stronger variant of Garnet.

Miru
- About Roo, it's cool, I can make it;
- About Soozie, she is already a stronger version of Garnet. The correct sequence from the weaker to the stronger is: Garnet>Soozie>Rubby>Grace>Emma
- About "defensive special, I don't know if you checked the Extra Menu yet but I can make a quick explanation about how it works in this new version. Now you have two ways to use Defensive/Offensive/Air special, spending 1/10 of your "Life bar" or spending "Energy stars". You can change this option in "Extra Menu" and the options are Life>Energy>Both. So, if you don't want to use your life for special moves, you can use only energy and your life will remain untouched.

Now the Rage bar don't exists anymore because that was a little confusing. In this new version, Rage refers to the skill only, like Super, Counter or Special. The stars below the lifebar refers to the current player "energy" stored to use these skills and not only to use "rage" skill.
But, maybe I consider a third option and include a "OK" bar like SOR3 and you can change between three types. I will make some tests for the next versions

16-bit Fighter
Yes, I agree to you in this point my friend but in fact, I'm resisting to use any SORR content for some reasons:
- First, is because my focus is on the three original games and I want to maintain more close to the original content possible (except for some sprites like Max Run and others that I can't find better)
- I have easy access to any content of the original games because I made some hacks in the past and I have a lot of tools to get any visual or audio material. I have a hacked Gens emulator version that can rip any sprite or background with high precision, but I can't find any SORR tool to make it easy. I tried to open the "Data" file but I think it is protected
- And last, I respect the Bombergames team too much. I know that I'm using all musics and some sprites, but I'm giving all credits to them. I sent a mail in 2018 asking your permission but no response. If they request me to remove all your content, I will do it instantly. So, if this really happen someday, I need to grant that I will lose less content as possible.

For now, I don't know how add SOR1 content yet because the sprites are smaller than the SOR2/SOR3, but any help is welcome

Darknior
Thanks man! And the Nightmare mod is not present in this version because it is a mod made by kimono. Maybe he can send you the link to download this great mod!

kimono
Thank you my friend! Let's go to your points:
- Although the two games are mixed into one, the main history is based on SOR2. In the first selectable route, the player are not choosing between two games (SOR2 or SOR3), the player is choosing between two start points in the city, like SORR. The player can change between SOR2/SOR3 routes many times during the game. So, although these icons are a good idea, maybe can confuse the player about this point
- About NPC partner, there is a lot of things to adjust. I left him go outside of the screen because if set "subject_to_screen" to 1, the player will pull the NPC through xpos, no matter he will be stucked on the walls or platforms. So, until I develop a better solution, the best option for now was to let the partner free to go outside of the screen. I'm trying to make a script to block player movement if the NPC is not moving, like in two players mode
- About back grabs, it can be a good idea. I will make some tests in future updates

 

[NED]

I finally gave a try to this new version.
I'm so impressed by the amount of work you gave to have something so polished.

Everything seems perfect. 8)

But I would say the hit sounds seems very generic. from SFA2 or SFA3.
Perhaps they can be replaced by some other sounds.

Is there a reason why grab attacks are done with the command Fwd + A?

I would suggest to add some more free special moves. If you need ideas or sprites, send me a line and I'll what can be done.

would be good to add some more custom throws. Particularly for Max (wrestling) and Blaze (Judo / grappling)

A good feature could be to add a 3D/Z axis roll with command U,U or D,D

All of this are just suggestions. Just to help.

 

[Kratus]

I finally gave a try to this new version.
I'm so impressed by the amount of work you gave to have something so polished.

Everything seems perfect. 8)

But I would say the hit sounds seems very generic. from SFA2 or SFA3.
Perhaps they can be replaced by some other sounds.

Is there a reason why grab attacks are done with the command Fwd + A?

I would suggest to add some more free special moves. If you need ideas or sprites, send me a line and I'll what can be done.

would be good to add some more custom throws. Particularly for Max (wrestling) and Blaze (Judo / grappling)

A good feature could be to add a 3D/Z axis roll with command U,U or D,D

All of this are just suggestions. Just to help.

nedflandeurse
Thanks! I'm glad you liked it.
However, I think maybe the game was not fully explored yet.

- About sound effects, I chose SFA2/SFA3/KOF sounds because these games has a lot of variety than the original SOR games, and a better quality too. Sorry, I understand your point but don't agree about the "generic" term because each sound is carefully chosen according to the move. For example, I'm following the correct sequence from Street Fighter linking damage to sound, LP>MP>HP-LK>MK>HK. I use KOF sounds with the same rule, Weak Punch/Strong Punch/Blow (I don't use KOF kick sounds). The slam/throw/fall animations will follow the same rule, linking the character size/weight to the sounds too

- About grab attacks, I don't know about what character you are talking but a lot of grab attacks will not end with Fwd+Attack. For example, in the video I show Max using knee attack x2 and headbutt x1, Blaze has knee attack x2 and punch x1, Axel has knee attack x4 and so on...

- About freespecials,  all characters, specially the heroes, has a lot of special moves to use: Special/Special2/Aerial Special/Counter/Super/Rage/Weapon Special moves/Weapon Rage moves. All moves can be combined to make combos and take any enemy down, includind the bosses. But I will always listen any new idea, maybe if you show some examples I can make some tests;

- About custom throws, in the video I show a variety of custom throws for Max and Blaze. But if you send me some examples I can make tests. As said, I will always listen to new ideas;

- About 3D/Z axis roll, this is alerady implemented. Check it in Extra Menu

I have to thank you to talk about your suggestions and I know that is to improve the game. I like to hear different opinions

Miru
At 02:13 you can see a example that I'm talking about Special Cost in Extra menu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zgs7Cp5SCKA&feature=youtu.be

 

[16-bit Fighter]

Yes, I agree to you in this point my friend but in fact, I'm resisting to use any SORR content for some reasons:
- First, is because my focus is on the three original games and I want to maintain more close to the original content possible (except for some sprites like Max Run and others that I can't find better)
- I have easy access to any content of the original games because I made some hacks in the past and I have a lot of tools to get any visual or audio material. I have a hacked Gens emulator version that can rip any sprite or background with high precision, but I can't find any SORR tool to make it easy. I tried to open the "Data" file but I think it is protected
- And last, I respect the Bombergames team too much. I know that I'm using all musics and some sprites, but I'm giving all credits to them. I sent a mail in 2018 asking your permission but no response. If they request me to remove all your content, I will do it instantly. So, if this really happen someday, I need to grant that I will lose less content as possible.

It's nice to know your position and I understand it.

For now, I don't know how add SOR1 content yet because the sprites are smaller than the SOR2/SOR3, but any help is welcome

These from SORR are so perfect that it's a goddamn challenge to make it differently without suffering by comparison... Maybe I'll be able to make some tests early in next month. Do you want these with strict MD colours?

 

[dai92]

I just did a playthrough with break "mixed and matched the 2 routes" brilliant work i love it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DY7DE97QMGw&t=4s

 

[kimono]

Kratus: Sega Bare Knuckle Mobile has redone all the SOR1 stages to fit with SOR2-3 size and CAjNatalie has
CajNatalie has all reassembled all SOR1 gfx and there's no problem for her as long as you credit her for the work done.
I'll send you all the stages and items if you want to make some tests.

The SOR1 characters are also all resized by Bombergames team (need to be credited also), the hardest part I think is to recolor the old md sprites and add them new moves and frames.
An example with juggler that I've remade for the Street of Nightmare mod:

I will be very glad also if you add Tracker boss and Game Gear route in SOR2 stage 2

 

[NED]

Kratus
OK, Thanks for the explanations.
I think I have to try more options and configs. I just played twice until now ^^

About generic sounds (sorry for my weird english) I was more thinking about the fact SFA2/3 KOF sounds are used a lot in fan games or mugen characters.
Of course, it's a good way to have some diversity!! This is just that to me it gives a "fan game-like" feeling to any project. Even if it's really polished like yours.

Thanks for the video. Again, I have to try more and also all the characters moves.
About some extra moves, I can send you a PM about some ideas later.

Thanks for the command list option.

 

[Miru]

Count me in as interested in having MS/GG and beta routes in the future.

 

[John_Couey]

It feels alot better to play now. This is a definite improvement.

 

[Kratus]

Kratus
About generic sounds (sorry for my weird english) I was more thinking about the fact SFA2/3 KOF sounds are used a lot in fan games or mugen characters.
Of course, it's a good way to have some diversity!! This is just that to me it gives a "fan game-like" feeling to any project. Even if it's really polished like yours.

nedflandeurse
Yes, you are completely right and I confess that I had not thought so... A lot of Mugen games (and Openbor too) are using SF/KOF sounds and now I understand better your point about the "generic" term.
Although SF/KOF has variety and quality, maybe can be better to use sounds that were never used or in a few games only. By this point of view, original SOR sound effects can be better than generic Capcom/Snk sounds.
Thanks for explain, now I will think seriously about change the sounds or at least make an alternative version with another sounds for test

kimono
Maybe BK Mobile will save the SOR1 route, thanks for the suggestion 
I made some tests with BK Mobile content during Harakiri creation a year ago and I have to say that this game can be fit well with SOR2X. The only bad part is about the characters that has too much black borders than the original games, but I think that the colors are good.
After launch some updates to fix bugs and finish bike stage, npc partner and Zan/Shiva SOR3, I will start the SOR1 content tests

Davpreec
Nice gameplay, thanks!!

16-bit Fighter

These from SORR are so perfect that it's a goddamn challenge to make it differently without suffering by comparison...

Yes man, it's a big true. Maybe we can try the SORR stages if the BK Mobile don't works for SOR2X.

John_Kuey
Thank you!

Miru
If the content fit to SOR2X and is from original games, I consider to add them.

 

[NED]

Again, about the sounds, this is not a priority.
I'm glad to help a bit.

 

[16-bit Fighter]

I played a few days ago and it was a real pleasure in hard mode (the others seem too easy or difficult)! It renews the SOR experience in a dynamic and sophisticated way! I'd like a sort of How to play, though, because I don't know exactly how counter attack works. I think bosses' furies are often unavoidable and irritating. Sometimes being juggled many times is annoying too (by ninjas especially). Another issue to me is the numerous lives gained, specifically in the Syndicate mode (very nice mode by the way!), and Adam's range basic attack less long than basic enemies...

I'll tell about sprites and background editing another day.

 

[Kratus]

I played a few days ago and it was a real pleasure in hard mode (the others seem too easy or difficult)! It renews the SOR experience in a dynamic and sophisticated way! I'd like a sort of How to play, though, because I don't know exactly how counter attack works. I think bosses' furies are often unavoidable and irritating. Sometimes being juggled many times is annoying too (by ninjas especially). Another issue to me is the numerous lives gained, specifically in the Syndicate mode (very nice mode by the way!), and Adam's range basic attack less long than basic enemies...

I'll tell about sprites and background editing another day.

Thanks 16-bit Fighter! As I said, I think that the game are not fully explored and I will give some explanations.

In the older versions, I received a lot of messages saying that the game are too hard, others say that is too easy. Each people wants your own custom SOR experience and it's very hard to please everyone. Then, I had the "Extra Menu" idea.
The proposal of this menu is to let each player customize your own SOR experience in some aspects, and I will show examples below.

I played a few days ago and it was a real pleasure in hard mode (the others seem too easy or difficult)!

This is the exactly the proposal that the game has 3 difficult levels in Extra Menu. "Normal" is really easier than "Hard" and 'Mania" is really harder than "Hard". For example, to casual players the Normal difficult is perfect and Mania is for those who want a hardcore experience. Even so, players says that they want a difficult more harder than Mania... I prefer to let the players decide wich difficult they want to play.

I'd like a sort of How to play, though, because I don't know exactly how counter attack works

I agree in this point. I'm preparing a digital manual and a "How to Play" scene to show basic commands. About the Counter, this is exactly how the Command List says. If you are holding block button, simply hold attack button together and when you receive the enemy hit, Counter will be performed.

I think bosses' furies are often unavoidable and irritating

All Rage skills has "seal" property and if any character take at least one hit, can't escape. But like players, bosses need to fill mp too and there are a lot of ways to escape from his "furies". For example, R. Bear uses rage when the player jumps, so if you not using jump against him, the chance to take his furies will be reduced a lot. Abadede uses Rage if you are away from him, so you can run and use dodge to make Abadede spend your Rage and you will avoid it easily. You can avoid Rages using Dodge or Counter too and each boss have your own weakness, try to explore it a little more

Sometimes being juggled many times is annoying too (by ninjas especially)

This is a new feature for this game, some people love and some people hate it. You can simply disable Juggles in Extra Menu if not like this feature. But remember, the main Heros can have a LOT of advantage against all enemies (including bosses) with juggles enabled. Being juggled by ninjas can be a very small cost compared to the benefits that it will offer. Another point is, now the game has "Aerial Recovery" move.  This works like Safe Landing but when you are knocked down by HIT and not only throwned/slammed. Press UP+JUMP when knocked down and it will INTERRUPT enemy juggles. Of course, this has a little cost of a full guard bar but it will fill faster.

Another issue to me is the numerous lives gained, specifically in the Syndicate mode

I agree in this point, I can review the score taken when beating enemies. However I made this because the Mania mode need a lot of lives. And for some casual players this number of lives will be little, so this may vary from player to player.

Adam's range basic attack less long than basic enemies

Yes, unfortunately the basic moves can be less long and I need to follow the sprites. However, he has more aerial potential than ground. His aerial moves are more long than a lot of characters and his Energy (Stars) can fill more faster than Axel. He has a "Super" move that throws a projectile against enemies that are away from him. He has kick moves that are longer like Pipe moves and you can use it as an advantage. His Counter uses a powerful kick and with "Extra Button" you can use kicks from your last attack move in your default combo (Combo End). Rage move will jump a great distance and will take enemies far away from him, and will pull juggled enemies to the ground. He has some good grab moves that can give a advantage to start aerial combos or use another moves that can hit in the air (as I said about the heroes juggle advantage).

I hope I explained well about these points. I understand the people that expect to encounter the same content as the original games. But my motivation is exactly to make a game keeping your root but with some new resources that I took from the best "Versus Fighting" Capcom/SNK games. However, you can disable ALL NEW RESOURCES in Extra Menu (turn off Rage, Counter, Juggles and Super Armor) and play like an original SOR2.

I appreciate all opinions and suggestions 

 

[16-bit Fighter]

Thanks for the thorough reply! I admire you created a menu to customize the game and if I let all your added mechanic features, it's because I want to explore the potential of them and I'm not frustrated I can't master them from the beginning. I don't want to play the same game as Genesis' SOR. In this purpose, SORR already exists and isn't beyondable (if this word exists ^^').

About Adam, where did you take these sprites from?

This is a new feature for this game, some people love and some people hate it. You can simply disable Juggles in Extra Menu if not like this feature. But remember, the main Heros can have a LOT of advantage against all enemies (including bosses) with juggles enabled. Being juggled by ninjas can be a very small cost compared to the benefits that it will offer. Another point is, now the game has "Aerial Recovery" move.  This works like Safe Landing but when you are knocked down by HIT and not only throwned/slammed. Press UP+JUMP when knocked down and it will INTERRUPT enemy juggles. Of course, this has a little cost of a full guard bar but it will fill faster.

I'm aware of the "Aerial Recovery" move but it's not useful against ninjas because they keep throwing shuriken after the player performs this move.

 

[Kratus]

Thanks for the thorough reply! I admire you created a menu to customize the game and if I let all your added mechanic features, it's because I want to explore the potential of them and I'm not frustrated I can't master them from the beginning. I don't want to play the same game as Genesis' SOR. In this purpose, SORR already exists and isn't beyondable (if this word exists ^^').

Thanks again, I'm glad you are playing my game, it's a great honor. I agree that SORR is a great work and I respect Bombergames so much. I'm only making another SOR and learning Openbor because I believe there is no "unbeyondable" game (if this word exists  ;D). I see here in Chrono Crash a lot of people with awesome ideas making your own games better than the original games that they like to play. Speaking about fighting mechanic I already prefer to play original (or hacked) SOR games. Speaking about cutscenes, remixed musics, new/re-drawn stages and SOR1 re-drawn content, SORR is really unbeatable until today.

About Adam, where did you take these sprites from?

These Adam sprites were made by Daors for a SOR2 hack called Syndicate Wars. I consider the SORR Adam the best sprite sheet but again, if Bombergames ask me to remove it, will be a great loss. That's why I used Daor's sprite sheet, that is also a great work

I'm aware of the "Aerial Recovery" move but it's not useful against ninjas because they keep throwing shuriken after the player performs this move

Aerial Recovery animation has no bboxes and you are invincible until hit the ground, no shuriken will hit you during this move... However, during Aerial Recovery you are in "jumping" state and can be canceled with any jumpattack, that has bboxes. Maybe this can be the problem, you are pressing some buttons after Aerial Recovery animation and being hit due to jumpattack bboxes, not aerial recovery bboxes. Even so, you can interrupt enemy juggles by hitting them with jumpattacks, this saved me a lot during my gameplays.
I understand, is my fault to not explain it in command list. But if used correctly, Aerial Recovery can be very useful against juggles

Edit: Below I show a video making some tests. I made a stage with 4 ninjas and I will try to simulate the same juggle situation. I will try to avoid it and count each sucess or fail in the screen. We have to consider some things:
- The difficult used is Mania, ninjas have more speed and aggression
- The slowmotion is activated to show more detailed moves, so the gameplay is horrible  ;D
- The counter called "juggle interrupted" will work when Aerial Recovery is used and any chance of enemy juggle is canceled
- The counter called "juggle not interrupted" will work when any enemy try to hit the player, while the hero is in the air and with a good distance from the ground to perform any juggle. If the hero is too close to the ground, it will not be counted
- During Safe Landing animation, the counter will not work (despite being one more way to escape the juggles)
- The counter will work even if the hero don't have enough "guardpoints" to perform Aerial Recovery when is juggled

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whMpaSfzjx0

 

[16-bit Fighter]

Thank you for the explanations!

I agree that SORR is a great work and I respect Bombergames so much. I'm only making another SOR and learning Openbor because I believe there is no "unbeyondable" game (if this word exists  ;D).

When I talked about SORR's unbeyondability (if this word...), I especially meant its accuracy with the original games. I hope I'm clear.

These Adam sprites were made by Daors for a SOR2 hack called Syndicate Wars. I consider the SORR Adam the best sprite sheet but again, if Bombergames ask me to remove it, will be a great loss. That's why I used Daor's sprite sheet, that is also a great work

I'm not a fan of this version but I understand why you don't use SORR's. I dream of creating my own one but I prefer keep focusing of making game first.

Beside, where is the SOR1's level 6 background from? And is it the only SOR1's level you put in SOR2X so far? Anyway, it was a good surprise.

 

[John_Couey]

I just hope the version of Adam, made by @16BitFighter uses his SOR4 move list.