Streets of Rage 2X

In Progress Streets of Rage 2X By Kratus 2.3.1

No permission to download
The project is currently under development.
I saw a video for this a while ago and was wondering when I'd be able to get hands on it! Can't say I mirror the sentiments of SoR being overdone, maybe it's because I only enjoy a small handful of SoR projects. That being said this definitely has the potential to be on of those enjoyably projects for the fluidity of controlling the characters alone.

The Pros
- combos are pretty smooth and do feel like it has impact to them
- presentation is great, wider screen to accommodate 4 players is a plus
- moves seem pretty solid, rage attacks always seemed to be something the game could add without going over board (especially if you consider SoR2 on the game gear had them)
- the audio is amazing, could use a little mixing but attacks sound like they hurt and other sounds are nice on the ears
- being able to see more of the stages vertically is another plus, feels cinematic

The Cons
- cowardly AI on standard goons, in some cases enemies stay off screen and refuse to advance, this is even worse when combined with the amount of space there is to walk in
- speaking of space, maybe the resolution is a bit too big, too much empty space at times, this could be fixed by maybe adding more objects, hazards etc to populate these areas
- bosses are tedious as hell to fight, they aren't so much as hard as they are just annoying and uninteresting. Rage moves  these bosses have are just a chore to deal with especially considering when you get hit with them they drain your special meter... wtf? In various cases they move way too damn fast, I gave up at zamza to be frank it kills the experience having to resort to cheap tactics to beat these bosses when you have a large array of moves in your arsenal
- HUD is pretty cluttered, what does the blue meter do? combo counter just gets in the way, enemy life bars could probably be shorten and moved next to the portrait to add a little more breathing room, not really a major problem but could help improve the presentations over all
- Blocking and Rolling doesn't feel natural at all, having a button for rolling specifically just feels unnecessary especially in a 2d brawler, the original method worked better. My suggestion as far as forward and backward rolling would be to have block animation cancelled into the two by pressing fwd or back twice respectively.
- Not being able to perform a special when meter is empty is also a bit grating at times, same with not being able to use forward special during a grab or while being hit. The latter is hit and miss though I always preferred the SoR2 method over 3 here.
- Juggles... I'll be honest I'm not seeing the allure in having this feature in mods. It's rarely implemented properly on it's own and most mods don't balance it out with things like having an aerial special, juggle limits, AI not being able to juggle with a simple jab etc. I don't feel like it fits in a grounded game like SoR at least not in this state.
- lack of staple features like vaulting and a robust grapple system, these things are very important in an SoR game, skate and Max specifically miss out on one of their special traits by not having these implemented.
- Explosions are really annoying in this game, just as it was SoR Remake. At the very least there should be a difference in radius depending on what the cause of the explosion is.
- visuals while nice clash pretty hard,
- I understand this is an SoR2 remake of sorts though it's a little disappointing not having at least adam unlockable in the game.

Overall most of the cons can be nitpicks against the design choices but outside of that this project has a ton of potential and I'm glad to see another quality SoR mod in progress.
 
I should clarify - I'm not against revisiting franchises. At all. It's just that SOR is a very special case, simply because of SOR Remake. I think Remake is a bit overrated, but never the less it is an excellent game in nearly every respect. For good reason, it is universally accepted as the ultimate classic SOR experience.

That's a big shadow to work under, fair or not. Your only options are...

  • A) Take SOR Remake head on, and beat it in every aspect across the board. Can that be done? Sure, and then some. But recall it took a dedicated team seven years to build SOR Remake. Styx might have that much time on their hands, but I doubt anyone here does.
  • B) Go your own way make something totally new. That's just as tough. Step too far off the rails, and it simply won't be accepted as a SOR game. Ex: The laughably awful SORXXX and its ilk.

Thank you DC for the deep analysis. I know the game still has some problems but I'm new to openbor and I'm still studying a lot about this fantastic engine. And this is not the final version of the game, I will make improvements and corrections in the next versions. I just do not understand what's wrong with random mechanics... What do you suggest improve?

I have a meeting in like, two minutes, but I'll get you some details soon as I can.

DC
 
Damon Caskey said:
I should clarify - I'm not against revisiting franchises. At all. It's just that SOR is a very special case, simply because of SOR Remake. I think Remake is a bit overrated, but never the less it is an excellent game in nearly every respect. For good reason, it is universally accepted as the ultimate classic SOR experience.

That's a big shadow to work under, fair or not. Your only options are...

  • A) Take SOR Remake head on, and beat it in every aspect across the board. Can that be done? Sure, and then some. But recall it took a dedicated team seven years to build SOR Remake. Styx might have that much time on their hands, but I doubt anyone here does.
  • B) Go your own way make something totally new. That's just as tough. Step too far off the rails, and it simply won't be accepted as a SOR game. Ex: The laughably awful SORXXX and its ilk.

This I certainly agree with, Remake has definitely raised expectations as far as revisiting the franchise goes. I guess I just meant as far as quality SoR projects go it's a bit of a needle in a haystack situation, I honestly look at a project and almost immediately know where my interest lies so I don't feel as overwhelmed as I am with the number of Final Fight and double dragon mods I see out there, quite a few of which while very well made kind of retread the same ground a lot of the time.
 
Din pretty much nailed it on the Pros and Cons. Fully agree!

Are you still working on your SoR game Din? I'm super excited for that ^_^
 
Even the original SOR isn't exactly a masterpiece, it felt clunky like one of the bad arcade ports on sega, it had low frame animations and even bad offsets.  If someone released it today as a MOD y'all would be picking it apart.
 
Psykai said:
Din pretty much nailed it on the Pros and Cons. Fully agree!

Are you still working on your SoR game Din? I'm super excited for that ^_^
Indeed I am, slowly but surely. :)

BeasTie said:
Even the original SOR isn't exactly a masterpiece, it felt clunky like one of the bad arcade ports on sega, it had low frame animations and even bad offsets.  If someone released it today as a MOD y'all would be picking it apart.
I mean, if you're talking about SoR1 I'd be inclined to agree but you still don't have a valid point considering it isn't an arcade port, it was the first game, it was released on the Genesis not PC and later consoles which meant limitations etc etc. Of course if you mean it's successors I'll just have to agree to disagree lol. I'll even give points to SoR3 for still being a pretty solid brawler even though I'm not too fond of the US version.
 
I mean, if you're talking about SoR1 I'd be inclined to agree but you still don't have a valid point considering it isn't an arcade port, it was the first game,
I can't agree more. SoR1 was an... ok game back in that day, but not that great. SoR2, on the other way, was a MASTERPIECE.

masterderico said:
Tried to run this game on wii (v.4453), no luck...  :(
Probably won't work at all in Wii. It doesn't have enough RAM to run it.
 
I apologize for my rude behavior. & Misjudged this mod in a very negative matter.

With that being said, this mod is leagues above the likes of Rage of the streets, sorxxx, bare knuckle the next generation, final rage chaos, anything by the person who made that disgusting zombies/corruptedcops/streets of russia travesty of a mod.

however, I still don't like all enemies being playable(looking at you syndicate wars). I suppose Barbon, Zamza, Abadede, & R.Bear get a pass. But I'm not a fan of playable grunts like Galsia, Donovan, & the other mooks. Jet is overpowered to hell & back. Mr. X looks dumb just staring at the screen as his idle stance(Wish bombergames just allow the BOR community to use his custom idle)

I'm glad you intend on making improvments to this mod though so I respect you for that. Please don't let my previous comments discourage you from continuing.
 
Yeah I meant SOR1 and I know it's not an arcade port, but quality wise it feels like one of those sega arcade ports.
 
masterderico said:
I love sor1 the way it is!

Can u guys post some examples of wrong offsets on that game?

+1 to this. SOR1 was an admirable first effort. The animation was a little choppy sure, but it doesn't have any production value issues. The only part that really feels rushed is the reused fonts and sounds from Revenge of Shinobi, and it's not like those were low quality assets. IMO, graphics aside it's superior to Final Fight in every aspect and still stands on its own. A fine foundation to the sublime SOR2.

DC
 
masterderico said:
I love sor1 the way it is!

Can u guys post some examples of wrong offsets on that game?
I love SoR1 but Mr.X, Abedede and various garcia's would LOVE to have a word with you about their lord and savior collision box. XD

I Can't tell you how many times I grabbed the former two and somehow they ended up on the other side of me LOL. though with that being said.
Damon Caskey said:
+1 to this. SOR1 was an admirable first effort. The animation was a little choppy sure, but it doesn't have any production value issues. The only part that really feels rushed is the reused fonts and sounds from Revenge of Shinobi, and it's not like those were low quality assets. IMO, graphics aside it's superior to Final Fight in every aspect and still stands on its own. A fine foundation to the sublime SOR2.

DC
Can't agree more and to be honest the reused assets really contributes to it's charm imho. Aesthetically SoR1 is my favorite of the 3 even the OST is arguably the best with SoR2 being a close second to me and most importantly, ADAM DAMNIT!
 
Damon Caskey said:
masterderico said:
I love sor1 the way it is!

Can u guys post some examples of wrong offsets on that game?

+1 to this. SOR1 was an admirable first effort. The animation was a little choppy sure, but it doesn't have any production value issues. The only part that really feels rushed is the reused fonts and sounds from Revenge of Shinobi, and it's not like those were low quality assets. IMO, graphics aside it's superior to Final Fight in every aspect and still stands on its own. A fine foundation to the sublime SOR2.

DC

I mostly agree. Except FF did have the Mega Crash moves and character-specific special moves in its favor, which SOR2 was quick to adapt, and IMHO they both beat Double Dragon.
 
Alright so I gave it a few more tries. The mod is still one of the higher quality mods, especially considering you only did this as an experiment. I'm determined to beat this mod without altering anything but I can't say I'm not tempted to crack this one open and see what makes it tick.

Anyway I hope my critique earlier didn't discourage you at all, the mod is solid but that's also the exact reason I took the time to critique it. It has a ton of potential as an SoR mod. Expect to see more runs from me for sure.
 
What I didn't like about this mod, is the fact that bosses spam rage moves, and once you get hit, you get all of your MP drained. Just remove that and this will be one damn good experience, I swear.

Other than that, I kinda liked it. Gets way too cheap and there's little variety on the attacks, but it doesn't feel clunky.

I suggest that you give a look at Pierwolf's mods, mostly Fighter's History Revenge.
 
hi Kratus.
I've tried your game, and I see some very good work on it. I liked what you did with webm, its way more practical than gif.
There are some cool scripts too, congrats.

I will write a full feedback when I have time, but there are some points I would like to share:

- The game suffer from a lot of slow down - down to be unplayable - in my Android phone (Quad-core 2.3 GHz, 4 GB RAM). I can notice a little slow down when playing the webm videos, but when you execute the Rage move, everything slow downs to somethinig like 5fps. I would need to investigate further, but it looks to be the after image/ shadow trail the culprit.

- I see there is a lot of things going in the Update script and maybe you would need to optmize it. For example, even playing with 1 player, I can see some stuff related to the other players in that menu.

- The menu could be reduced to not be so poluted. Here is my suggestion:
B6b3TN5.png

(the press start would be the line with Hit and Max hit)
 
DintheAbary said:
I saw a video for this a while ago and was wondering when I'd be able to get hands on it! Can't say I mirror the sentiments of SoR being overdone, maybe it's because I only enjoy a small handful of SoR projects. That being said this definitely has the potential to be on of those enjoyably projects for the fluidity of controlling the characters alone.

The Pros
- combos are pretty smooth and do feel like it has impact to them
- presentation is great, wider screen to accommodate 4 players is a plus
- moves seem pretty solid, rage attacks always seemed to be something the game could add without going over board (especially if you consider SoR2 on the game gear had them)
- the audio is amazing, could use a little mixing but attacks sound like they hurt and other sounds are nice on the ears
- being able to see more of the stages vertically is another plus, feels cinematic

The Cons
- cowardly AI on standard goons, in some cases enemies stay off screen and refuse to advance, this is even worse when combined with the amount of space there is to walk in
**KratusGH: I agree, but the A.I. options are limited. I will improve this

- speaking of space, maybe the resolution is a bit too big, too much empty space at times, this could be fixed by maybe adding more objects, hazards etc to populate these areas
**KratusGH: I agree, can be improved in the future updates

- bosses are tedious as hell to fight, they aren't so much as hard as they are just annoying and uninteresting. Rage moves  these bosses have are just a chore to deal with especially considering when you get hit with them they drain your special meter... wtf? In various cases they move way too damn fast, I gave up at zamza to be frank it kills the experience having to resort to cheap tactics to beat these bosses when you have a large array of moves in your arsenal
**KratusGH: Forget a little the original SOR or Final Fight because in this game you have to explore enemy weakness, use strategy and new resources like cancel move with Rage, Dodge, Block, Counter, Juggle, etc... 
I´m trying to get out a little from the "smash button" games and make a system more like the VS games (Street Fighter, KOF, etc)

- HUD is pretty cluttered, what does the blue meter do? combo counter just gets in the way, enemy life bars could probably be shorten and moved next to the portrait to add a little more breathing room, not really a major problem but could help improve the presentations over all
**KratusGH: I agree, in parts. About the blue meter... Well, when i see original SOR3 for the first time, the "OK" bar was strange, but a few minutes playing solved this :) I´ve maked a "How to Play" section explaining that. About the enemy life and combo counter I agree, can be improved in the next update. Maybe a enemy lifebar in the head, like RPG games.

- Blocking and Rolling doesn't feel natural at all, having a button for rolling specifically just feels unnecessary especially in a 2d brawler, the original method worked better. My suggestion as far as forward and backward rolling would be to have block animation cancelled into the two by pressing fwd or back twice respectively.
**KratusGH: I agree, in parts. About Rolling, I´ve played a lot the original SOR games and the original dodge system (up, up or down, down) is too much poor compared to a free dodge system like 3D games to any direction. It´s simple, hold a direction and tap Dodge button. About Blocking, is easy to make and I´m changing to "hold button block", because I agree that the press button a lot of times is terrible :)

- Not being able to perform a special when meter is empty is also a bit grating at times, same with not being able to use forward special during a grab or while being hit. The latter is hit and miss though I always preferred the SoR2 method over 3 here.
**KratusGH: About the forward special during a grab, yes is possible and I´ve scripted it. About being able to perform a special when meter is empty is a bit complicated... First, my intention is not to make lifebar a "extension" of the special bar, because they are two totally different things. Second, the special meter is for SPECIAL skills only, a bar dedicated to special moves and Rage too, like a lot of VS games like KOF. However, you can use Rage with 2 special bars + 20% of the life cost. For example, you can use forward special and rage.

- Juggles... I'll be honest I'm not seeing the allure in having this feature in mods. It's rarely implemented properly on it's own and most mods don't balance it out with things like having an aerial special, juggle limits, AI not being able to juggle with a simple jab etc. I don't feel like it fits in a grounded game like SoR at least not in this state.
**KratusGH: About juggles, again, forget a little the original games. It can be useful against bosses but you need to practice a little to do a good use.

- lack of staple features like vaulting and a robust grapple system, these things are very important in an SoR game, skate and Max specifically miss out on one of their special traits by not having these implemented.
**KratusGH: Max and Sammy have all throws and slams from the original. About the vault, it sucks! In the original games it's very frustrating when you want to grab front and make grab back, it will broken all the combo and you have to lose time (or life) to vault and grab front again. In the new system you will always grab front and with same all moves from grab front and back.

- Explosions are really annoying in this game, just as it was SoR Remake. At the very least there should be a difference in radius depending on what the cause of the explosion is.
**KratusGH: I don´t uderstand your point... Explosions are only explosions... And not have too much things who cause this. Grenade, Jack Bike or Robots death.

- visuals while nice clash pretty hard,
**KratusGH: ...

- I understand this is an SoR2 remake of sorts though it's a little disappointing not having at least adam unlockable in the game.
**KratusGH: Will have Adam soon

Overall most of the cons can be nitpicks against the design choices but outside of that this project has a ton of potential and I'm glad to see another quality SoR mod in progress.

I´m very grateful for your analysis and your point of view. I understand that this game have a lot of diferent things from the original and some people don´t agree with it. But it is impossible to make everyone happy. I'll do my best to improve a lot this game. The next update will be launched soon.

PS: I replied in your own post above

Thanks!
 
masterderico said:
Don't blame me for that, but imo this mod is better than sorremake in every aspect.

Best sor mod ever, kudos to the developer, guy is a genius.
Thanks man!!
 
Damon Caskey said:
I should clarify - I'm not against revisiting franchises. At all. It's just that SOR is a very special case, simply because of SOR Remake. I think Remake is a bit overrated, but never the less it is an excellent game in nearly every respect. For good reason, it is universally accepted as the ultimate classic SOR experience.

That's a big shadow to work under, fair or not. Your only options are...

  • A) Take SOR Remake head on, and beat it in every aspect across the board. Can that be done? Sure, and then some. But recall it took a dedicated team seven years to build SOR Remake. Styx might have that much time on their hands, but I doubt anyone here does.
  • B) Go your own way make something totally new. That's just as tough. Step too far off the rails, and it simply won't be accepted as a SOR game. Ex: The laughably awful SORXXX and its ilk.

Thank you DC for the deep analysis. I know the game still has some problems but I'm new to openbor and I'm still studying a lot about this fantastic engine. And this is not the final version of the game, I will make improvements and corrections in the next versions. I just do not understand what's wrong with random mechanics... What do you suggest improve?

I have a meeting in like, two minutes, but I'll get you some details soon as I can.

DC

This is true DC, I totally agree with you. It´s a problem because it´s impossible to make everyone happy with the game. Each player want your own version of SOR, but refuses any improvement in the game. And I do not want to make the same game as Remake or Original because It's a waste of time, I can simply download the Rom and play it. But I will continue to work and do my best.
 
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